Thursday, April 8, 2010
Freud and Proust
For this blog post, I would like you to simply compare the writing of Freud and Proust. What similar themes do you see in both Sigmund Freud's "Dora" and Marcel Proust's "Remembrance of Things Past?" Do you see elements of psychoanalysis in Proust's writing? Are there any similarities in form or narrative structure? Feel free to make any additional comments about these two writers.
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
One potential similarity I see between the two is the sense of incestual relationships and a child having sexual feelings for his/her parent. Freud brings this up in Dora when discussing her relationship with her father and how he felt she had sexual desires for him and that is why she was mad about his relationship with their family friends. In Proust he seems to beckon his mother over often and even when he doesn’t need to and this can be read as his desire for an incestual relationship with her. This is one big similarity between the two and is very hard to miss.
ReplyDeleteAs discusses in class, Freud had never read Proust, and Proust had never read Freud; however the two had very similar themes and motifs such as the development of internal desires versus those expressed and the overall psychology of the human brain. While Freud creates a setting in which he is with a patient, Dora, who is undergoing extensive psychoanalysis, Proust develops the human psyche in a more subtle way. Both writers describe the mind using realms of comprehension. Freud develops of the unconscious while Proust simply states that "the past is hidden somewhere outside the reach of intellect". They shared similar ideas on the mourning process after having lost a loved one, through their similar belief of emotional investments. They both believed that to love and to be loved is to invest energy into that person. The one difference between the two would be the birth of a new media , that of cinema/film, during Proust's time, which in a sense caused art to lose the sense of aura surrounding it, making it more readily accessible and mass produced. The negative aspect of this is that it lost its uniqueness and everything slowly became mainstream into society. Both writers also seem to he in a quest of self-discovery, this is often expressed through their characters in their incestuous relationships (or thought of incest) with their parents. This Oedipus complex reflects on the thoughts of the time in which they wrote, as well as defeats the boundary in which a writer may express sexuality in their work.
ReplyDeleteSomething I found interesting was that Freud never read Proust and Proust never read Freud. I think from the standpoint of Proust it made sense because he was not really interested in the neurological and scientific reasoning behind people. But for Freud I do not understand why he wouldn't have read Proust, a lot of his theories and ideas showed up in his writings and I feel like he would have had more concrete reasoning behind his ideas. Especially with the relationship Proust had with his mother.
ReplyDeleteOne similarity, that I'm sure most people have noticed as well is the idea of children having sexual feelings for the opposite sex parent at a very young age. I personally find it to be interesting but at the same time I am a little disturbed by the idea. Freud was a strong believer of the Oedipus complex, but I do not think Proust believed in it to the same extent.
As far as their writings go, Freud was much more scientific in his works especially in "Dora" which seemed almost more of a compilation of his notes from his sessions with her than a piece of literary reading, and granted is was a case study but still I found it hard to read. Proust was more enjoyable to read with more of a typical story emerging, even though the length of his work is to be honest, quite ridiculous. I don't know how anyone would be able to find the time to read "In Search of a Lost Time" all within the same year.
Proust was very interested in new media such as the bio-scope which was a pre cinematic device for motion. And I think this new technology affected his writings because by the time he began to write lots of new media existed.
I also found it interesting that Freud had never read Proust, and Proust had never read Freud as stated by previous posts. Both of these writing, I felt had psychoanalysis, from Dora's sexual desires to almost everything and Marcel's desires for his mother's kiss. Both of these desires are from a younger child towards the adult (within the family too). It just analyzes that we are all sexual beings as a child as well as an adult, which I feel is normal. But Freud places such emphasize and analysis (scientific and autobiography-like) that it comes out very strong, where Proust doesn't focus all of his writing on the psychoanalysis of the mother-son relationship (more story-like). Freud gives off a feeling that he is very head-strong about his studies that he doesn’t care what the society of that day would think of him where as Proust intertwines it to make it less contradictory.
ReplyDeleteIn Proust’s writing, there is a sense of psychoanalysis of himself. He analyzes his own relationship with his mother in a similar fashion to the way Freud analyzes Dora’s relationship with her father. Another element that seems similar in their writing is the idea of analyzing dreams. Freud actually analyzes Dora’s dream to make sense of her past but Proust analyzes the idea of dreams. He dreams what he has been reading, while Freud believes that everything Dora dreams has to do with her sexual frustration.
ReplyDeleteI find it interesting that neither man read the other’s work, especially Freud. As previously mentioned in another post, Freud would have found an excellent example in Proust for his Oedipus complex. Freud could have drawn many conclusions from Proust, since in his writing, he admitted things, such as his love for his mother, that Freud was trying to uncover from other individuals.
I find it extremely strange that neither Proust nor Freud read each other’s work, because it is very obvious to anyone who reads them that there works are very similar, especially due to the fact that they each seemed to have a “thing” for writing about the desire that children have for there parents. In Proust it is evident that there is some obsessive attraction that he shares for his mother in his writings, just as Freud portrays the character Dora to have an infatuation with her father. There styles of writing I would consider different though. For one thing I found Proust work to be much more interesting, since it wasn’t presented in such a scientific form that I quickly lost focus on it. It just seems so coincidental to me, that such popular authors, who wrote about such unpopular topics for the time have never read each other.
ReplyDeleteBoth Freud’s “Dora” and Proust’s “Remembrance of Things Past” view the human through the lens of psychoanalysis. Freud is the clearer example of this; he is the father of psychoanalysis. Proust is more difficult to directly to relate to psychoanalysis. Proust inadvertently uses many of Freud’s themes; the two never encountered each other’s works. Proust clearly addresses the Oedipus complex through his relationship with his mother. He spends a lot of time addressing the nature of dreams. He shows how elements of the past affect the personality of the present. Clearly, the issues addressed are very similar in the two works. What truly separates these stories, however, is the structure. Freud employs a detached, clear writing style; he makes his intentions known and explains why he is addressing the issues he addresses. Proust, because he is an author, writes in a more novel sort of form. Proust, in short, is writing a novel in the vein of Rousseau’s “Confessions”, where Freud is writing a scientific report. These, of course, match each author’s intentions.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThe themes in Sigmund Freud's "Dora" and Marcel Proust's "Remembrance of Things Past" are very similar. Freud uses association and the subject of memories in hopes that it will cure Dora. Proust also uses association when he is thinking of himself thinking. He also remembers his past as a way of mourning and letting go of an era and start new. Also They both find worth in psychoanalytic theory. Freud uses psychoanalytic theory when he is proposing root causes for Dora's symptoms. Proust uses psychoanalytic theory when he remembers having a distinct kind of love for his mother during his childhood.
ReplyDeleteThe stories of Dora by Freud and Remembrance of Past by Proust are both very similar. In Dora, Freud believed she was sexually attracted to her father. By analyzing her dreams, Freud believes she has thoughts about her father, which ultimately lead to everyone thinking she needs help and why the psychoanalysis takes place. While Proust never read Freud, the theme throughout Remembrance of Things Past, was very similar to his research. In the story, the relationship of the mother and son come into question and how he constantly "needs" her and wants to kiss her. Even when he is capable of being on his own, he still begs for her and she still rushes to his side. This description is very much like the one Freud uses for Dora. They are both younger children who are believed to have desires for a parental figure in their life.
ReplyDeleteFreud and Proust's writings are very similar to each other. They both talk about obsessions that themselves or a character in their writings have for a parent or parent figure. In Proust's writings he talks about how he has an obsession that he shares for his mother, and in Freud's writings, Dora, has an obsessive urge for her father in the story. It's strange that neither of them have never read the others work since in this example they are very similar and could have learned a little from each other. However their styles of writing are also different in other ways. Freud's writings seemed more straight forward and it seemed like everything was based on science whereas Proust's writings were more free writing and he didn't seem to relate everything to science.
ReplyDeleteThere are some similarities between Freud’s “Dora” and Proust’s “Remembrance of Things Past”. The major connection between the two writings would be the Oedipus Complex. Freud and his psychoanalysis describes this condition as a child, mostly male, fighting for his mother’s affection. In Freud’s work, Dora is described as having jealous and sexual feelings for her father. Similarly, the feelings Marcel has towards his mother and the constant need he has for her kisses is reminiscent of the complex. Additionally, both authors are interested in time. Freud had his clients retell each memory in order to construct an accurate timeline of the past. He believed that this was essential in uncovering repressed memories. The way Marcel told his story reminded me of this. Marcel’s autobiography lay out his past in a flowing and coherent way. Finally, both authors discussed the importance of memories, which often coincided with time. Marcel forced himself to look back at his memories in order to go back and time and retrieve old memories. Although Marcel did force himself to find these memories, they occasionally came up involuntarily. This reminded me of another aspect of Freud’s psychoanalysis, the Freudian slip. Freud believed that these were unconscious slips of the tongue. The way Marcel unconsciously thought of these memories was similar to someone saying something without intending to. Even though Freud’s work was much more scientific than Marcel’s, there are many parallels between the two writers.
ReplyDeleteBoth Freud and Proust focus a lot of attention on memory, specifically unconscious memory, though they approach the subject in far different ways. While Freud focuses on dream analysis as a manifestation of the subconscious, and applies these elements to sexual desires and frustrations, Proust examines the subconscious as exposed by the input of the senses. Additionally, Proust does not focus all of his attention on sexuality; he also brings into focus love and jealousy from a more platonic sense. Proust in some ways could be described as a hopeless romantic, while Freud, despite his logical failings, can only be considered as a detached scientist.
ReplyDeleteI think the thing that most stuck out to me in this introduction to Proust’s Rembrance of Things Past as being Freud-like was the presence of the Oedipus Complex. Young Marcel is unable to function without the love and affection of his mother, demonstrated in her goodnight kiss. On nights when his parents have guests over, Marcel’s mother does not kiss him goodnight. This leads to Marcel’s hatred of their guest Swann, solely because his presence means Marcel will not get his kiss. One night, after being denied a kiss, he has the maid take a note to his mother asking her to come see him. He convinces her to stay the night in his room. Winning his mother over is the only solution to his nerves, despite the fact that his father finds the whole thing silly. This desire for the affection of his mother is an example of what Freud called the Oedipus complex. The uncanny resemblance is surprising as neither read each other’s work.
ReplyDeleteIn both Freud’s “Dora” and Proust’s “Remembrance of Things Past” there is a common theme of dream analysis. The differences in the writings of Freud and Proust, lie in their intentions behind interpreting dreams. For Freud, dream interpretation was a mechanism of his psychoanalytic theory, in which he felt he could uncover the deepest hidden desires of the human mind. By reconnecting a patient with the desires of their subconscious, the psychosis, or in the case of Dora, her hysteria could be cured. Proust’s writes of his own dreams, seemingly as a way of reconciling the bizarre nature of his dreams and their reflection of his past experiences. In terms of any evidence of psychoanalysis in Proust, he does at one point analyze his relationship with his mother, which is comparable to the way Freud delves into Dora’s relationship with her father. However, Proust’s recollection of being raised by his mother and the emotions he felt for her does not go to the extreme of the connections Freud draws from Dora’s relationship with her father and her sexuality. Perhaps this goes back to the authors’ intentions in using dream interpretation and psychoanalysis. Again, Freud’s goal is to help Dora understand and thereby control her hysteria, whereas Proust appears to be writing simply for the personal enjoyment of discussing his dreams and memories.
ReplyDeleteI feel that both Freud and Proust focus on the subconscious, and on memory so in that way they are similar. Proust's writings about his mother definitely have evidence of the Oedipus complex as well. However I feel that they have different approaches and maybe different goals as well. Freud uses psychoanalysis and subconscious memory to find the root causes of behavioral problems. Proust on the other hand seems to be reliving his dreams as a means of enjoyment rather than as a tool. Freud wants to help Dora, and so looks to her dreams for information as to what is causing her hysteria. Proust on the other hand seems to be reminiscing about old times for his own pleasure
ReplyDeleteAs many of my classmates have pointed out, one of the most obvious similarities between Freud and Proust was their belief in the "Oedipus Complex". Although Freud fathered the idea of "unconscious love relations...between a father and a daughter, or between a mother and a son", Proust's writing demonstrates its existence. In "Remembrance of Things Past", Proust writes about his interest in his mother and her kisses. In "Dora", Freud writes about his patient's interesting relationship with her father. The difference between the two writings, I think, is the extent to which each author focuses on these relationships. As my classmates have mentioned, Freud is more interested in studying the cause behind Dora's struggles so he studies the Oedipus Complex in detail. Proust, however, is not so interested in curing anyone or anything as much as he is in simply stating his story. In this way, the two men's writings are different.
ReplyDeleteGrace Mellor
ReplyDeleteAs discussed previously in the blog the most obvious similarity is the theme of Oedipus complex that is salient through both narratives. However, Frued points out that Dora has sexual desires for her father, but Marcel only discusses his attatchment for his mother and his father disdain. Freud would Proust and claim straight away that Marcel suffers from the Oedipus complex, but perhaps Proust does not see the strong attachment as wrong or sexual. Both authors also greatly emphasize the importantce of sleep and the unconscience, however, Freud recognizes the revealing natureof dreams while Proust thinks that sleep muddles identity and memories.
I believe a similarity is the way that the two authors discuss in some detail the way in which the subconscious mind works. Proust's work is obviously recounting the narrators life, and such memories play host to even more memories, to the point where biting into a cookie can elicit a strong nostalgic reaction that brings to mind many childhood memories. I think this relates to Freud in that he often talks about the subconscious as well, but in more of a "present tense". In Dora, one example of this is how the crick in her throat is supposed to represent a deep subconscious reaction to her experience with Herr K.
ReplyDelete